With Henry gone, we have:
Selvin Young
Michael Pittman
Ryan Torian
Andre Hall
Anthony Aldridge
Plenty of depth and ability in that crew. I like the group. What do you guys think? Thumbs up or thumbs down. I agree with Mike. Sometimes you have to cut your losses. We have the depth, and if we can keep healthy this year, we should make some progress on last season’s record.
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http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2822035
jazzyfrrizzle is so right about CP vs. Champ, read this article from 2007 about the 2006 season and who should be NFL defensive MVP. You especially need to read Eric Allen’s part as well as Len Pasquarelli’s part as they are some of the NFL “experts”.
All I have to say is in 2006 Ron Jaworski stated on MNF pre-season against the 49ers that Bailey only got tested 35 times and only 4 passes were completed over him for 0 TDs, once again ONLY 4 PASSES COMPLETED and 0 TOUCHDOWNS ALLOWED all 2006 season. Name a CB that has had a season like that. And most experts say that he is the best shutdown corner since Deion Sanders, but one thing Sanders could not do that Champ can is tackling, and he is the best tackling CB in the game, most fans of other teams fear that when a RB or TE comes there CB’s way is that CB is not going to make the tackle, but here in Denver you know Champ is going to make that tackle.
Also CP’s numbers have been and will do nothing but decline in washington, the redskins havn’t done anything in the playoffs, but even though we haven’t won a ring with champ at least he gave us a chance in 2006 by beating the patriots in the playoffs and helping us get to the AFC championship a lot more than CP can say there in Washington.
All I can say is that and especially here in Denver, you can easily find a RB that can put up numbers, but think of how hard it is to get even a decent CB, its a lot easier to name the the good RB’s in the game, but not so easy to name the good CB’s in the game and Champ is the best out there period.
In my opinon and I think most here in Denver we got the better end of the deal.
Yes, Portis was great for our system, BUT EVRY ONE IS! Last year was the first year since we traded Portis that we didn’t have a 1000 yard rusher. That was because we had 3 different starters over the course of the year because of all the injuries. And since we traded Portis, no person in the ENTIRE NFL has had more INT’s. So in my opinion, we dominated that trade.
i would make the trade for champ with cp hands down everytime. champ pretty much takes his side of the field away from qbs 9 outa 10 pass plays portis isnt a threat to score every time he touches the ball because he get hurt to much, champ plays through injurys more often then not portis warms the bench i think at the end of the day champs value is way more because we cant just plug any1 into our cb spot and have them make the pro bowl year after year and even when they have a bad year statisicly.
portis was good but he was too cocky and we dont like that round here!! Champ is the man….and is the reason we even made it to the AFC championship that year…with his huge pics all year in the redzone…and even better taking it from brady to secure the game….how many playoff games has Portis been in??? i dont know all the stats i just know Champ is the best CB in the NFL…and Portis now a days barely cracks the top ten for HB’s
Im not sayin our system is wrong for champ, but when a corner cant play bump and run they have no control of the receiver, and they are in a strictley reactionary position, champ has all the skills needed to play bump and run witch by default is better than playing off of the receiver after all the greatest corner to ever play the game played bump and run and addvocates for champ to be allowed to play it more often to take complete advantage of his skills.
And wit this “every one is good for our system” bull chowder, i wont even include last year in the discusion, Clinton put up rediculous numbers here that no back since has come close to, and he was barely getting 20 carries a game and putting up 15 and almost 16 hundred yards rushing. And why is 1000 yards the magic number people look at??? you only need like 66 yards a game to get 1000 really is 66 yards a game an IMPACT thats the differnce betwen clinton and mike anderson, and this laughable stock of backs weve had lately, CP and Mike won games for us made an impact, you cant say that any one since then was the reason we won a game or.
And for you people stating oppionions wit no facts Porits has had a 1500 yard season in washington and was 6th leading rusher last year, and thats against a 8 man box every down, which in denver he wouldnt have to deal with, and he’s only 26.
Im not trying to bash champ or anything i love him to death but with him not playing bump and run here, hind sight says I would have to say i would rather have seen Portis here, knowing that we havnt won a super bowl yet, it would be nice to see if that would be different if we kept portis, now if there was a way to get both of them here in denver that would be the day i become a resident of this broncos fairy tale land that so many of yall live in.
So you think Portis is the man huh. You are looking at some numbers, as am I. So let me tell you the numbers I see and why they dont impress me. For starters, CP is the centerpiece for the skins… which he should be since they have crap for a qb and have for a while. With that being said, he gets the ball quite a bit. So here is some numbers and some comparisons. Last year CP was 6th in the league in rushing, correct, but he averaged 3.9 yards per attempt. Not so hot. Which means the reason he was 6th was because he ran the ball so much. With Denver, he averaged 5.5 YPC. Much better. Now lets go down the list. Last year Selvin Young averaged 5.2, and Travis teamless Henry ran for 4.1. A little better than CP, and keep in mind this is with our banged O-line from last year, w/o nalen and hamilton. lets go to the year before. Tatum bell averaged 4.5 YPC, and Mike Bell, 4.3. 2005? Mike A, 4.2, Tatum Bell, 5.3. And lastely, in 04, Droughns had 4.5. Okay now lets get back to CP, after he cried his way out of denver, he hasnt averaged more than 4.3 yards a carry. And the only reason he still cracks the top ten in yards is because most teams are realizing that their backs stay healthy more often when doing a runningback by committee. Washington has not done that yet. Good ole CP tied for 68th in the league in yards per carry. hmmmm….. Anyways, since CP is not in a committee back field. Expect all those YPC to decline along with his yardage totals. because in Denver, his 5.5 looked really nice, but if you look at his progress from then till now, it looks like this 3.8, 4.3, 4.1, and 3.9. Not too good, if we ran the ball as much as washington, especially with one guy, we would do better than CP’s 78 yards a game he averaged last year. Last year we were 9th in the league with 122.3 yards a game, washington was 12th with 116.9. So, sorry but CP is just average. Champ, not so much. Champ has 21 int’s over the past three years. So I know you aren’t bashing champ, but you are giving CP more praise than he deserves. With an improved O-line this year and a bulkier Selvin Young. Look for his numbers to increase.
I think Ryan Torian will be huge because if he wouldn’t of been injured his Sr. season of college I think he would have been a first rounder but Selvin Young’s the most experienced of the group and possible the most talented. Plus he knows the system already.
Thats because we have a better overall offense Santan moss has had one good year in washington. Jason campbell would look oh so much better if he had better receivers around him, that wouldnt let teams put 8 and 9 guys in the box, we dont have that problem in denver weve always had a good threat from the passing game that teams have to respect.
And dude you just proved my point no one has touched Clintons production from when he was in denver. And if Tatum bell was so good hed still be here, but oh yeah he fumbeld the ball as soon as the 4th quarter started, if mike bell were so good he wouldnt have been moved to full back. And you know what every one wants out of selvin young this year??? to look like clinton portis when he was here, to have that same kind of impact and game breaking ability CP had. CP set the standerd here and mike knows it and he wont stop shuffelin backs untill some one lives up to that standard.
any body know what td’ ypc was for his years with us was?
TD’s ypc in his 2,000 yard season was 5.1. he had 21 td’s that year. And MC, you should just stop now. It seems as though you only read bits and pieces of what I say. I did not prove your point. I proved my point, that runners do better in Denver and fail to do as good when stuck in other systems. if portis’ 5.5 going down to 3.8 ypc isn’t proof then I dont know what is. But we have had our share of backs who average 5 yards per carry. And they don’t put up the same kind of numbers that they did when they were in denver. CP has not scored more than 11 td’s in a season with washington, but with us? 14 and 15. So he was good in Denver yes, but other backs and tandems of backs get the job done just as good, and they dont complain about the money either, they play for the love of the game. Something portis failed to do. Do me a favor and show me ONE article where someone who knows anything about football states that their expectation for Selvin is to look like portis. Of coarse any coach would want their running backs to put up 1500 yards a season and score 14-15 tds. But what you fail to realize is that if anyone has been mentioned as a hopeful comparison for selvin, it is TD. He said it himself, he thinks he can put up around 2,000 yards, something portis will never do. TD is hall of fame material. CP is not, he is only so so. Period.
just fyi, this link had the stats of the first game denver played against the skins, our replacing the old 26 with new one. Who was the man here?
http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/recap;jsessionid=E4D7DBD9BF903E2D93276D0CB6C7D124?game_id=28596&displayPage=tab_recap&season=2005&week=REG5
Good point, jazzyfrizzle, but look at Tatum now.
I know, the lions o-line havent produced any great rb’s as of late. tatum is just one of my examples of the fact that our system is so great that it doesnt matter who we plug in. They have been a pass first offense for a few years as well, and those have been years that tatum has been there. I just noticed something that I think most people havent realized. Because the Lions don’t run the ball much, tatum’s numbers took a huge hit. Last year was tatums only year with the lions, and he averaged 4.1 YPC, and only ran the ball 44 times all season. Last year CP averaged 3.9 and ran the ball 325 times. If the lions let tatum run the ball 325 times at 4.1 yards a carry that would equate to 1,333 yards, which is better than CP’s 1,262. So for what it’s worth, I guess it just goes to show, it all depends on who you are playing for and how they use you. Just ask Boss, the lions don’t use most of their players right.
If your standard for running back is for each one to be a hall of famer then your crazy, and dont ignore numbers that defeat your argument, TD averaged 5.1 yards a carry the year he got 2000 yards, he got 2000 yards because he had almost 400 caries, and Mike has said it plenty of times that he regrets doing that to terrel and will never use another back that way. So once again Portis put up numbers that no other back in a denver uniform has ever done, Mike wont give another back almost 400 carries he knows its not good for the team or the player because after a few years they gota go and find another back, so if selvin can get 2000 yards off of no more than 300 carries than he can go right ahead and do it beacause mike wont give him any more carries than that.
Clintons production was what mike wanted it to be, if he would have stayed in denver he could play for 15 years and put up consistent big numbers. And I already said that CP’s numbers in washington dont touch his numbers in denver, thats established you people continue to throw that out as a way to say “look he’s only average” My whole argument is about what has happend in a denver broncos uniform, 5.5 yards a carry no one has touched it, and no other backs and tandems have not got it done, once again if where getting it done why arnt they here??? answer is because mike wants a number 1 guy, who can dominate, take over games, be game breakers.
And heres a list of other backs who have had over 5 ypc since CP left
Tatum bell in 2004 had 5.3 on 75 carries, in 2005 he had 5.3 on 173 carries. Ron Dayne also had 5.1 on 53 carries. After that season every one thought Tatum would have a break out year in 2006 as the starting RB, mike anderson was let go and picked up by the ravens, ron dayne was also let go and went to houston. What happend that year Tatums average droped to 4.4 ypc only scored 2 touchdowns and allowed a undrafted rookie in mike bell to take his carries away, a mike bell who the following year was beat out by another undrafted rookie in selvin young which forced him to play FB. What does this prove, that mike wants a number #1 back if not he would of kept every thing like it was, and he wants that #1 back to have over 5 yards a carry. Tatum couldnt get it done as a #1 so he’s gone. But make no mistake 4 ypc is good in the NFL but after seeing what CP did in denver he knows his system can do better.
Any of that sound like a succes??
Now its Selvins turn once again im hopeing he can keep that average, and actually make it go up with an improved O-line and a more consistent offense. But its not too often in the NFL where a #2 RB looks as good the next year as the #1 RB, i hope selvin ends up being one of the few exceptions.
oh yeah heres a little more of those other backs and tandems “getting it done” leaving 2007 out of the argument: 2006 TD’s by RB=11, 2005=22 thats the year we went to the AFC championship, pretty good year, 2004=12, 2003=17 CP had 14 of them. There where 2 years where a stable of backs couldnt match what Clinton did.
CP set the standard here not TD because mikes not gona give any one 400 carries, and mike is willing to sacrifice good production (22 td’s 2500yards) from a tandem of backs if he thinks he has a #1 that will give him what he wants, and what he wants is over 5 yards a carry in less than 300 carries. and game breaking ability.
hey, do you know mike? cause you sure seem to know what he wants and thinks, what he is willing to do….. Any resources backing up these statements about mikes decisions? Or is that just what it looks like on paper? Otherwise you are talking jibberish. Because really, mikes theory is if a back shines during practice, preseason or just in an opportunity in a game, then they will have earned their playing time. And he gives them an opportunity to play in the NFL. The great thing is, the rest of the league sees how good these backs are, and we are able to trade them away if we want and get some good players via trade. The only time since CP. that I remember mike looking to have a prominant back who can be the ONE man who carries the load is with Henry.
So If we would have lost that last game to the vikes last year, we would have picked probably 8th or ninth, just for a new topic, do you all think we would have still picked clady or do you think we would have picked someone else?
Oh so i guess you do know mike, youve got him on speed dial huh. The way i see it Iv proved all the points i was out to prove, and have given more than enough to back it all up, you can go look at the stats see the trend look at how no back other than TD has had more than 300 carries in a year think about the roster moves, ive done all the home work. so if thats all you can come back with yeah we do need a new topic….. seeing how no one else is really reading this any way. And most of our backs are released to free agency and picked up by other teams and are released shortly after, other than the portis trade, we got Bly in the tatum and foster trade.
And why go to a “what if” topic that would of ment the Vikings would of made the playoffs lets not walk down this road any further. Heres a what if for ya What if we drafted Willis mcGahee or larry johnson instead of George Foster, in the first round of 2003. We could of still made the portis bailey trade and we still would have had one of the best running games in the game man the draft can break your heart lookin at it from hind sight
Hey mc,
Lets just agree to disagree. We are starting to get mean for no good reason. We both proved some pretty good points. Some i think kinda helped some of my opinions, some yours, and some probably we agree on but we look at from totally different angles. We both support the same wonderful team, we both hope that they do good this season, and face it, it’s getting pretty boring proving our points over and over again with a lot of the same facts and points. So sorry for bashing you at times and lets get ready for a good training camp/pre-season. We are gonna shred them chokeland faiders in game one! Go Broncos. Hey Coop time for a new blog, you had a great subject on this one, keep it up.
This was a great blog, i think this si the only blog i have ever read were i kept checking in on it every day and accasionally put my input, but I agree with jazzyfrizzle. Time for a new blog.
P.S. jazzyfrizzle, why did you pick that name.
its just a fun name friends used to call me back in high school since my name is jesse, name developed from the original nickname jazzyfresh.
Hey has anyone checked out andrew masons stuff on the carolina website. His stuff is called mason’s minutes. It’s funny how much better it is reading about your own team, i got bored trying to read just one of his posts on there. Oh well…….
NEW BLOG
you rock coop