1:15 P.M. MST: Waiting on the start of Head Coach Mike Shanahan’s press conference … It’s likely to be an interesting one, considering the situation in which the team finds itself right now. The locker room late Sunday afternoon was understandably morose; it reminded me of another scene in the same room five years earlier, after a 28-16 loss to the Raiders gave the Broncos their seventh loss (in Week 16) and took control of their playoff path from their hands. But the Broncos did rally to win the following game soundly against Arizona seven days later, for what it’s worth.
Back with more when Shanahan walks into the room.
1:29 P.M. MST: “Who would like to start it off?”
1:30 P.M. MST: Of Selvin Young: “It’s hard to tell before we get back on the (practice) field.” Said that he would get more into the injuries on Wednesday.
1:30 P.M. MST: When asked what he would most like to see out of the team in the next four games: “Wins.”
1:31 P.M. MST: On the run defense’s performance at Oakland: “It’s a combination — it just takes one person being out of position, one person missing a tackle. That’s what run defense is … Since the bye week, that was not one of our better games (defending the run).”
1:31 P.M. MST: More on the run defense: “Obviously, we’d like to be playing better than we’ve been playing … We did some good things, but you’ve got to be consistent.”
1:32 P.M. MST: “Anytime you give up 4-for-5 in the red zone, 80 percent touchdown ratio, that’s not good … we all know that’s common sense football; it doesn’t take a genius.”
1:33 P.M. MST: “We’ll see what we’re made of. It’s tough in this league not to win. You go through some very tough times, some very tough moments, but we’ve got the character to fight through it and hopefully we’ll start this Sunday against Kansas City.”
1:34 P.M. MST: “Our game plan going in was not to play Travis (Henry) that much; I thought it might come back to haunt us and it did … We gave him the ball too many times.”
1:35 P.M. MST: On Jim Bates and his defense and having faith in it: “That’s a really a good question. You talk about as soon as there’s a little adversity it’s going to go back to the coach. We’re all disappointed, we’re not keeping them out of the end zone as much as we are. We’re disappointed in not scoring as many points to put the ball in the end zone. Anytime you’re giving up points or not scoring enough points, it’s disappointing. I’m disappointed in myself. It’s my job to get the job done. If we don’t get it done, it comes back to me. Don’t worry about Jim Bates or the coaches or the offensive line coaches. Talk about my situation. Do that and we’ll be all right.”
1:36 P.M. MST: “We’re going to play to win. We’re going to play who we think will give us the best chance to win,” Shanahan said when asked about the possibility of playing young players this month.
1:37 P.M. MST: Shanahan said he still hasn’t heard anything regarding Henry’s appeal of a potential suspension.
1:37 P.M. MST: On the wait for a resolution of Henry’s appeal: “I’m not frustrated. When the NFL makes a decision what they’re going to do, I live with it. Sometimes they make it quick. Other times for whatever reasons, it takes longer. I can’t speak for them.”
1:38 P.M. MST: When asked whether this was the toughest season of his career, Shanahan replied: “Yeah, it’s tough. Anytime you lose it’s really tough. Especially when you’re kind of used to winning. It’s tough.”
1:39 P.M. MST: Said Javon Walker improved from his game at Chicago, playing 20-25 plays. “He does look better.” Shanahan added it was “hard to say” whether Walker would be back to his former full-time workload by the end of the regular season.
1:39 P.M. MST: When asked whether this was like the 1999 6-10 season, Shanahan said, “Let’s wait until the end of the season before we make this a losing season.”
1:41 P.M. MST: On whether the Broncos still had a shot at the division title: “Sure, we’ll have to get a little luck in there and play much better than we’ve been playing … I think we need to worry about playing a complete football game before we worry about the playoffs.”
1:41 P.M. MST: And … we’re out.
Tags: Oakland Raiders
First of all, the Plummer situation might have been handled poorly last season but it did give Cutler 5 games to play in and gain experience in which he learned from and worked on all off season. I fully believe had Cutler not gotten that experience he wouldn’t be as the maturity level he is at now. This season has nothing to do with Plummer, or Cutler for that matter. The problem has not been at QB or really even the offense. The only problem on offense is the red zone offense. If Cutler was throwing 3 bad passes in the red zone then you can say its his fault. But I do question the play calling. Too many runs when we don’t have any decent short yardage backs. Henry and Selvin are not move the pile 2 yards Jerome Bettis type backs. As a whole though, I like what I see in the offense and it is more effective than it was last season.
I think it is fair to have some criticism for Henry. His legal issues have been a distraction. While the Broncos might not suffer much at this point if he does get suspended it has not been positive for the team to have this hanging over their heads for almost the entire season. The NFL would have done the Broncos a favor if they had just made a decision weeks ago, even if it was to ban Henry. I also don’t appreciate Henry fumbling twice, I consider that handoff against the Raiders a Henry fumble.
The defense has been a complete joke this season. Mistackles, penalties, corners getting burned, lack of forcing turnovers. I’m not ready to point the finger entirely on Bates but maybe it was the combination of too many new players, too many band aid free agents, too different of a scheme, something. Maybe losing Ebeneezer in training camp hurt the defense more than we know. Things looked bad in the pre season game against Dallas and it really hasn’t improved from there.
Special teams is still atrocious. They did nothing to improve it this season. I really don’t care much for Saurbraun and I’m one of the few people that don’t blame the Chicago loss entirely on him. Ernster was a better punter and kickoff guy than him. Plus the entire group as a whole has been very poor. Its not a good sign when you have to put Champ in there as a safety guy.
I am a loyal Broncos fan and I’d love to have hope. I’m still going to go to the last 2 home games because I love to cheer on my team and I hope for a win. But lets get real, the season is over. If the Broncos can’t win 2 or 3 in a row they are not going to wave the magic wand and win 4 in a row. I’d love for it to happen. If San Diego loses to Tennessee and we beat KC there will probably be some sort of mathematical hope again. But I’d like to see a little more from this team before I get excited about the prospect. Its just been a disappointing year from start to finish. Things just didn’t feel right even in pre season.
dont give up on this season. titans are a much better team with haynesworth and are capable of beating the chargers. maybe the lions pass offense can take advantage of the chargers weak secondary.
the offense cant get any worse than they were against oakland. They SHOULD win the next 2 games and we ll most likely be only a game behind going into the san diego game. The chargers have LT but other than that they are very overrated.
Well here is my 2 cents worth. The reason the offense looked so piss poor is aparent. We had no healthy running backs running the ball. The running game never got going, thus the passing game couldn’t be affective. Henry only ran hard when he was close to the end zone. Andre Hall was sorely missed as was Young. Hall is the back that should be starting when he’s healthy. Hall is a complete running back and fits the system like a glove. Young should be #2 cause he provides a change of pace back. Another reason they looked so bad was due to the play calling. I’ve said this all year long, the offense is way to predictable. And what would you say? If your having trouble with the basics, don’t try trick plays. Results typical. Somehow, the coaching staff has to understand that Cutler is at his best out of the pocket. Play action only works if the running game is established early on. All of you ready to jump off the Cutler Banwagon, hang on, he will be one of the greats. He trusts his arm an aweful lot, and sometimes, it comes to bite him in the ass. Ok, now to defense, it’s obvious there are some major problems. Champ Bailey is not the same. He isn’t even having success this year. Bly, oh my, he gets beat week in week out. This scheme is not the right fit for these players. All are trying to overcompensate to pick up the slack of another teamate.
Another words, Corners, who would be typicaly worried about pass first, are just the opposite, they are thinking run first. Biting on play action, gets you beat everytime. These players are very talented, they are not being coached properly nor put in the right place to make things happen. The decisions will be tough in the off season for Shannahan, but even he must realize that Bates must go. Bring back Coyer, find players, who provide the push up front, run stoppers and pass rushers, then put Bailey and Bly in a better position to concentrate on the pass first, run second, how it’s supposed to be. Sorry fans, if their are too many personell changes it allows no chemistry to develop between players. My 2 Cents for whatever it’s woth.
Did someone really say Elway “wasn’t Elway before Shanahan”? AHAHahHAHAHAHAHAHHAAH!!! Yeah, Elway had some of his better seasons when Shanahan came back, but I believe that’s also around the time Rod Smith, TD, Eddie Mac and a whole slew of others came along. Shanahan definitely helped Elway’s late-career revival, but come on….the man was magic before then. And yes yes yes, I am well aware Shanahan was a qb coach here way back when, but Elway was engineering miraculous, game-winning comeback drives (more often than not with the whole team riding on his shoulders) at least as early as his Stanford days, not to mention a couple of times against Cleveland that stand out, one against Houston….. Don’t start the Cutler vs. Elway crap, because there is NO WAY the kid can win that one in this town, and we have already forced that junk on a few qb’s now. It’s a no-win situation. He wears 6, so why don’t we just agree that he’s better than Bubby Brister, and leave it at that for now…….
Oh, and very nice post tigervixxen. Other than inconsistency (which is an evil that plagues all young offenses, and will improve with time), the biggest problem with the offense is the play-calling, especially in the red zone. This dive, dive, force an incomplete pass because we have trouble protecting the qb and don’t use the shotgun much, field goal stuff is getting old. Every time we get within about the 5-7 yard lines, I think about what great hands Kyle Johnson has, and how he always seemed to get open on play-action bootlegs in that area….
what is going on? why all the same plays? draw up some new stuff shanny. as for henry, he just doesnt look like he has heart. this team needs heart since they cut Wilson the heart and soul of this team. without wilson this team looks flat on both sides of the ball. maybe we can get a guy this year who has heart.
Can I say it one more time. We need some huge changes. Bates and Shanahan need to go. Predictable play calling, crappy drafting the past several years and his current attitude just show he is ready to move on now. Mike may already have plans set to move elsewhere in the league after this year. Perhaps he is trying to sabotage us this year for next years gain even. I’m just throwing this out. Something is just not right with him this year. But he doesn’t seem to care. We have the worst defense in the history of the organization. Oh, can we also get rid of our high dollar corners (Bly and Bailey) so we can focus on some new talent on the offensive and defensive lines. Henry can go as well as we already have the position covered for next year.
Maybe if we all create some additional usernames we can create some pressure (if we all call for Mikes departure) and really make some changes here. The organization responded to the fans outcry for Plummers departure.
VANCE JOHNSON ,RICKY NATTEL, MARK JACKSON,
b. marshall, stokley,walker.
THERE WILL NEVER B ANOTHER ELWAY, BUT J CAN B JAY!
“As soon as there is a little adversity, it’s going to go back to the coach,” Shanahan said Monday at his news conference. “We are all disappointed. We’re not scoring as many points and putting the ball in the end zone. I’m disappointed in myself. It’s my job to get the job done. If we don’t get it done, it comes back to me. Don’t worry about Bates, the offensive line coaches or the other assistant coaches. Talk about my situation, and we’ll be all right.” Alright Shanny, so answer ALL of us this, WHY DOES JIM BATES STILL HAVE A JOB?!
read tigervixxens post, its the best ive ever read on here. and he is 100% right, all you true fans know what im talkin about im from colorado Ft. Collins actually, and i now live ten miles north of mexico in a place called Deming N.M. so its hard for me to get any good sports coverage on the broncs, but i have to agree i didnt think we would be succesful coming out of the preseason…mainly after the dallas game. my old man has been watchin the broncos since the 1960 expansion he knows the broncos but knows the game as well. after we played dallas he said “we’re in for a long season son” not meaning long as in going deep into the playoffs, but the one like were watchin now. i drove 800 miles to watch the chargers spank us like school girls but still sported my throwback gradishar jersy with pride,then and now. im not a fair weather fan, i seen #7 go 5-11. it sucked but i still cheered as loud as i could for the broncs. i hope we win out cuz that will tell me that the team (players) still have pride, and it will be something positive for next year. so cheer loud for the titans and lions and hope that we play 4 games of bronco football. peace out
Is Mike Bell ever going to play again?
all these people jumping off the bandwagon will try to get back on after we beat KC and Tenn beats SD…..I always thought Broncos fans were more loyal…to those who still believe, keep it going!!……
the Chargers also play at OAK the last game and you know how the Raiders always get up for the Chargers so its possible the Bolts lose that game too…..if we win out, I think we will still win the divsion…
as for Wild Card..we still have a shot there too…if we win out…we need the Browns and Tenn to lose a few games…very possible as Tenn plays at KC, SD, and at Indy….Cleveland plays at Jets (who are playig better), buffalo, and at Cinn….
I will not give up until we are mathmatically eliminated….
why>???
Because im a DIE HARD Broncos FAN!!!…some of you disgrace me by calling your self a fan, and then saying the season is over!!!..
You always believe in your team..no matter what!!
Go Broncos!!
Why are people bashing Cutler or the offense. Jay has done a good job this year. He had a few bad games, but this is only his first full year as a starter. Give him a break. I see a QB with a lot of talent, a great arm, and some smarts too. Are you all forgetting how bad John Elway looked his first two years. Jay looks like a stud in comparison.
I agree with clutch, but this is very difficult. Many fans including myself expeted a much better season with all the talent we have, but I still root for my team through thick and thin.
A lot of fans are throwing players under the bus and I don’t agree with it. They have thrown Bly, Bailey, the entire D-line, Williams, Cutler, Henry, Marshall, Kuper, Myers, Lynch, Graham and probably others under the bus. They can’t make plays unless the coaches put them in a place to make plays.
Many fans have been throwing the coaches under the bus, which I think is more appropriate. I agree with Shanahan that it all starts with him. I agree with other fans the playcalling is conservative at best and the D coaches haven’t been putting our playmakers in position to make plays. If they know it’s them, then why has nothing changed this season? The only thing that hasn’t changed is the inconsistency.
I watched the last two games with a crowd and no one in the crowd thought giving Henry or Hester the ball was the way to win the game…NO ONE! I give the decision makers a “F” so far. I will watch and root for my team the rest of the year and hopefully the decision making gets better. This team right now is better than the decision makers!
Denver Broncos, please don’t make me bleed any more blue and orange, I live and die on gamedays. I could paint a house with my blood right now.
Bronx2729,
I agree…what is up with the playcalling inside the 10 yds line…if we don’t score from outside the 10 yd line, its an automatic FG…its ridicouls…why aren’t they aggressive inside the 10??
Also, I hate that pass into the flat they run to Sapp…sapp isn’t a good runner after the catch so why run it…it didn’t work the first 2 time so why run it a 3rd time like they did against the Raiders!!
I blame Bates more than anything…Shanny needs to use his creativity more….oh and the special teams coach…again this week we give up big returns on kickoffs and punts..and a stupid penalty on running into the kicker…how are we not firing our Specials teams coach….
I agree that I expected a much better season but with that said..I still believe in my team and think we will get it done and get into the playoffs…I can’t think any differently cause they are MY Broncos!!
I really like Denver’s offensive potential. Jay is going to be great. Brandon Marshall has more potential than any WR I’ve seen since TO. Hopefully the fame doesn’t turn him into a TO or Chad Johnson kind of guy. With Javon Walker healthy, Marshall, Stokely, and Sheff at tight end, we could be really dangerous. Our running backs are good. I prefer Young and Hall over Henry. They seem more hungry and none of them has been a distraction this year. I really like the speed of Young. I admit that the O-line has been better in the past, but they are still good. I wouldn’t change much on offense.
We move the ball better than anyone between the 20s, but we still struggle in the red zone. That will improve as the team matures and we get some consistency at RB and WR. Look at Peyton Manning before and after Marvin Harrison’s injury. He is still a good QB, but his numbers and their offensive production is down. It is because he doesn’t have chemistry as much now. Once our WRs and RBs are healthy, or if Jay and the subs get more time together, we will see improvements inside the 20.
Shannahan does a good job calling plays. It does get obvious sometimes inside the 20 though. But, it is probably habit. The last few years, we had a good defense. If we scored FGs, that was OK. This year, the D has struggled. We could use more TDs instead of FGs.
BUT, I must point our one thing that isn’t being discussed. Special teams. If you want to blame the D for being suspect at times, that is OK. But, our special teams is the biggest problem. Other than 1 return for a TD, we have been awful this year. In fact, the special teams have been weak for many years. We need an exciting player returning kicks. Our offense starts with the worst starting field position in the league. What do you expect from them. The defense also suffers because we can’t cover kicks. We lost to Chicago because of this. It isn’t just Devin Hester. All theams play better than us on special teams. That is where we need help.
Jim Bates? I don’t know. The system hasn’t worked. I can’t blame him yet though because there are flashes of brilliance. Maybe it really is just one player missing his assignment. I can say one thing. Put up or shut up Dry Bly. You have got to be better than you have been this season. I trust all our corners more than you right now. You are the worst run stopper ever. Champ is great not only because he covers well, but because he tackles great. Dre has been burnt many, many times this year. Our defense played well against Green Bay, but on play 1 of overtime Dre alone gets burnt. You have to know the situation. I have seen this happen a lot this year. It is all on Dre. I have also seen Dre get lucky. He’s been burnt and the pass has been overthrown. Making a few picks does not make up for everything else.
We need to improve, and it could start by drafting a premier corner/kick returner or trading for one. A real one that is.
Okay- so this is in no particular order of importance but…
A.
Shanny’s play calling has def gotten stale, but that is no reason for talk of firing him (for whatever reason, there has been a lot more of that than I would expect lately). He is a great coach, he just needs to freshen his game plans some.
B.
Get Henry outta there! The only way he is going to run with fire and purpose is if they put Hershey bars (or some good bud) in the endzones.
I like Selvin, although I don’t think he is able to plow through tackles like Denver needs their backs to… Andre Hall seems to be a great back who runs with a lot of purpose and has a lot of power. I’d like to see more of him.
C.
It seems as though the entire defense needs to be scrapped and rebuilt. Champ is playing like he is losing a step, and I don’t think DJ Williams is quite comfortable enough at MLB. Nate Webster has stepped up as of late, but I don’t think he is playing at his ideal position either. I actually think that, of everyone on the defensive side of the ball, Dumerville and Lynch (surprisingly in his older age) are playing the best. When the D line and the LBs screw up, Lynch is always there to make the tackle- particularly when it comes to the run. And, obviously, Elvis is a force of nature when it comes to hurries and sacks (ref: the Bears game- there was holding against him on almost every play to avoid giving up a sack). And what is Bly doing? He makes the occasional good play, but he certainly isn’t living up to the hype (or his salary).
I am not giving up… but I certainly feel downtrodden (as, I’m sure, all of Broncos country does). We just need a breathe of fresh air on this team…
I think Shanahan is trying to do that by bringing in a bunch of new guys, but not only does that make it harder for there to be unity and chemistry on the team (with guys coming and going every week), but it isn’t necessarily the talent that needs new life: its the scheme. Mix things up some, don’t be so cowardly in the redzone, open up the passing game more, switch up the running game some- I like when we get marshall the ball in that facet of the game… We are in danger of a losing season, and obviously what we are doing right now to prevent that (playing conservatively, etc) is not working. At this point, I don’t really care what we do differently so long as we try something different!
Go Broncos- keep the faith, guys.
GOD! Why wont anyone just admit, that as Darrent Williams said, once Shanahan benched Plummer, this ENTIRE team lost confidence. They lost confidence in the coach, in the decision making and all else above. He said there was QUIT on the team, of course there was quit when a coach benches a 7-4 starter for an unproven rookie. That quit IS STILL WEARING THE BRONCOS DOWN! Look at all your comments, about Bly, about Champ not playing as hard.
They’re collecting paychecks half of last year and all of this year!
LetPlummerPlay.com
when I say “scrapped and rebuilt in reference to the Defense, I am referring to the scheme, calls, positions- not necessarily the players…
(although I am not a big fan of Bly)
LPP…Cutler is a better QB now then Jake was at his best. Give it a rest girl.
DAMMIT! Read my post, I’m not talking about JAKE Vs JAY! I’m talking about MIKE SHANAHAN’s crappy decision making and his teams lack of faith!
LPP, from what I recall the team actually watned Cutler to start sooner rather than later. Last years decisions have no effect on this years team, it’s what he did AFTER the season that’s killing us. Bates scheme is awful, it simply doesn’t attack the line. Defense is about going after the ball, not sitting on your heels and letting them dictate how you play. Once Nalen went down our entire line became exposed. Kuper isn’t good enough to start, Pears needs help EVERY PLAY and Meyers is a first year starter at CENTER! I still say Bailey is hurt but get Bly the hell out of here please.
hrdnokd….the Darrent Williams comment was in every paper around town. Where in the hell can you find one player that said they wanted CUTLER to start last year? You will never find that, not in print that’s for sure. Darrent was the only one with balls big enough to question the decision in public. No one else said, yeah we’re glad about it. And prior to Cutler starting no one publicly said they wanted him over Jake, except of course Shanahan!
Im still trying to be optimistic, 4 turnovers inside the raiders 40! How is a defense supposed to keep up with that when they are constantly on the field in the redzone? The broncos can win these next 4 games and the chargers could lose to anyone one of those 4 teams as well as the broncs, there is still hope the Broncos need to play hard and not make mistakes, its possible. When the Broncos have 8 losses then we can talk about next season.
Also, I am impressed with Cutler this year, its not his fault we are losing these games I know hes had a few crucial picks, but Cutler will be a great quarterback for the future of the franchise.
LPP, you’re taking 2 and 2 and making it equal 5.
Here are two stories with the quotes from Darrent Williams to which you refer:
Associated Press
The Denver Post
Where does he talk about the Plummer/Cutler decision? Oh, yeah, nowhere — because he didn’t.
What had him suggesting some had quit was frustration over a four-game losing streak, which, by the way, happened under the stewardship of both quarterbacks.
While Williams suggested that some players had quit, you’re making a Snake Canyon leap to say that they’d lost confidence in the coach or that they were questioning the QB decision. I was in the locker room that day and can assure you that is not what Williams was trying to convey.
There’s other issues going on, to be certain … and while I don’t necessarily agree with your take on things, at least you usually work from facts … now you’re going into interpretation of the words of someone who’s not on this earth to clarify them. I know you’re better than that.
hrdnokd : Actually, I do believe last year’s decisions affected this year. Cutler was batted around like a cat toy in his first two starts and again in the last game of the year.
Rookies do not build confidence getting crushed with playoff spots on the line, nor is it beneficial to send them back into a game with a possible concussion, as Shanahan did with Cutler last year against the Niners.
Cutler had some good stat lines in his three of his five starts last year. This year he’s had three good lines out of twelve games. His good games don’t automatically equal wins (Chicago this year, SD last year.) Is this really progress, for either Cutler or the Broncos? Notice how this year Jay’s more prone to getting rattled after a big hit than he was last year–prior to the disastrous San Francisco game? Shanahan’s treatment of Cutler could potentially give the kid some bad habits that he DIDN’T have before he came in last year to get molested by the Seattle D.
Also before last November, Mike Shanahan had NEVER thrown in the towel before a season was over. NEVER. His players never had any reason to think he was a coach capable of doing so. So Mike put in Cutler and told the team “okay, time to play for the future; the present isn’t working.”
They were 7-4. In 2006, SHANAHAN GAVE UP ON HIS SQUAD AT 7-4!!! Now, in 2007 there’s precedent for “giving up” in the Broncos locker room. The only thing that counters such malaise is winning. Well, we aren’t winning, are we?
Thank you Andrew…LPP, you need to get over this Plummer thing, maybe even get some mental help. I remember that article as well and I don’t remember anything being said about quitting because Cutler was starting. I do recall seeing on HBO, FOX SPORTS and several other printed articles that the players had wanted Cutler to start earlier in the season. Either way it’s all water under the bridge though and for the life of my I don’t get why you want to pin the success all on Plummers shoulders. Now I will agree with you on this, Shanahan has royally and totally screwed this team up for the season with his roster moves and personnel moves.
Hey Shutout,
good..don’t give up faith….
i’ve done some calcualtions taking into account all NFL tiebreakers…
if SD loses to Tenn and Denver….we still need them to lose another because they would own tiebreaker over us….now if SD loses to Den and Oak, then we would win division as long as we run the table….i spent hours looking at all the different tie breaking possibilities…SD could lose to TENN, and then Det and then us..then we would win division….
but more likely is that SD lose to DEN and Oak…then we win division….
Wild card…we need Tenn and Cleveland to lose 2 times….
we need to cheer on the jets this week…..Tenn has a tough schedule with SD, Indy, and at KC…….
i have tons of other scenarios worked out but I don’t want to bore you guys….
i won’t lose faith until we really are out….
Go Broncos
By the way, the worst thing about last year is that at 7-2(actually before the season even started) many fans were whispering how the team needed to make changes and by 7-4 they were calling for Plummer’s head, saying the team had no guts, calling for Larry Coyer to be fired, blah blah blah blah.
This year–with an arguably easier schedule, perhaps the easiest in the league outside of New England–if we were 7-4 those same fans would be practically spraying each other with champagne and talking about how we were going to shock the world and start the next NFL dynasty in January (and laughing at LPP for even hinting that Plummer was worth a squirt of p*ss) Can we get a little perspective? Or at least some consistency?
(Not referring to you, Mase, you’re fair and balanced in my book.)
yeah Cutler looks Phenomenal this year. I mean 13 TD’s and 12 Interceptions, that’s PHENOMENAL!
Actually, putting Cutler in wasn’t giving up on the season. As Shanahan himself explained, it was to try and make a playoff run:
“When you are averaging 17 points a game and you are 7-4, you’re not going anywhere in the playoffs averaging 17 points a game. We put Jay (Cutler) in there, and we are averaging 25 points a game. You’ve got a chance to do something in the playoffs if you are averaging 25 points a game.”
At the rate at which the Broncos were scoring points in Plummer’s starts last year, they would have finished 0-5 down the stretch, since they never allowed less than 20 points a game in that run. Scoring 24.8 points per game, as they did in Weeks 13-17 last year, at least gave them a chance.
The offense was broken when the switch was made. I, for one, would rather see a team make the effort to push buttons to try and revitalize it than making no changes and accepting it as it is.
Yeah, but Mase, by putting in a rookie against Seattle, the defending NFC champs and the (at the time) Super Bowl favorite Chargers in San Diego when you KNOW you’re having big time offensive line problems is an invitation to crash the car before you even get to the highway. Cutler predictably got tossed around in those games (2 INTs, 7 sacks, 5 fumbles, and a lot of hurried throws.) They only hung in there with Seattle because the ‘Hawks were an injured mess last year on offense and the scores against SD came when the Chargers got lazy in the third…after the second TD woke them up, they resumed schooling Cutler.
Shanahan refused to publicly acknowledge that it wasn’t just the QB causing the problems, it was the O-Line and defense as well. Let’s say Cutler provides two TDs a game as opposed to Jake providing one. When your D starts giving up four TDs a game, as Denver did from week 8 onward last year, there are bigger fish to fry. Plummer got scapegoated for the mid-season slump (and no credit for the early success.) Coyer got scapegoated for the late-season slump (and ditto.)
Now it appears that Bates and Henry will be the scapegoats shielding Shanny from the blame this offseason, won’t they.
VegasBronco;
I have to disagree with your comment on Bubby Brister.
He then (when he was backing up injured Elway) was better than Jay right now with better playcalling by Kubiak. Jay needs to learn to scan at least a half of field before he pulls his trigger. His vision is narrow right now (seems he already decided where to throw before the snap) and opponents are reading his eyes.
Mas, you are like god to DenverBroncos.com….the site runs because of you, and it’s the 2nd place i go when i get online (behind facebook of course!!) But seriously, how is this season happening like it is? I was for Bates when we hired him. I was for Bates after preseason. I was for bates after our first 5 games, after 10, and even after the chicago loss that nearly left me in tears. But when Jim “All hail the god of defenses” Bates, puts out a sorry ass defense on the field like he is now, with no less than 4 or 5 probowlers and 3 or 4 young up and coming players, it is not acceptable. Obviously you, shannahan, and the players cannot ridicule him during the season, but this is horrible. When Rex grossman comes in and wins the game against our D, we have problems. Keep in mind, we didnt lose the game because of Devin Hester, after his 2nd return, we came back, and kept it at 14 points. We lost that game because Jim Bates’ defense couldnt do anything to stop an offense which hasn’t been “GO”ing in 5 years. The season is not a loss until we are knocked out of the playoffs, but needing to win our last 4 games, to salvage a porus 9-7 season is not anything close to the expecations of this year. This year was supposed to bring cheer and W’s and all it has brought was sadness and L’s, L’s that should be W’s, that are unexcusable, and are in large part due to Jim Bates. Fire Jim Bates. Keep the same players in tact in the offseason. Keep the “Jesus” of DenverBronbos.com Dominique “Blogmaster” Foxworth. And keep Mike Shannahan. But seriously, the issue is Jim Bates, im sorry, i cannot stand for it anymore, and i cannot support his horrible coaching job this season, that has ruined a good time.
P/S Jake Plummer is gone. Let it rest.
Mason, you got any intern opportunities with the broncos??
I don’t blame Bly or Bailey or any of the players on the defense, or that were on the defense. I agree it’s the scheme. This team doesn’t attack the line of scrimmage not because they don’t want to, they are told not to. There is a lot of talent and playmakers on this defense that are not being put in the right place or scheme by the coaches. This scheme is making Pro Bowl players look less than average.
It doesn’t help that they have such a short field to defend almost every game. How long does it take the special teams to learn 9 plays? It’s not the players!
I have a Cowboys friend who watches the games with me and we call the Denver offensive plays almost to perfection. We are not experts as much as we would like to think we are, but if we can call them then most likely other teams can easily. The offense is anemic, not because of lack of talent, but because of lack of ingenuitive playcalling that lets players play and make plays.
If it’s all three phases of the game then is a clear indication that it’s not the players. It’s the coaching! Shanahan said it himself. So wtf has changed this year?…Nothing- That’s what is upsetting. We see the same thing every week and are expecting different results?…not me. Coaches keep saying the same BS things and changing nothing. The Patriots say “We are going to do this!” Denver says “We are going to work on this.” Big difference!
Make some changes in your schemes and playcalling or make a change in venue. There is enough Blue and Orange bleeding to paint Invesco Stadium, so put a tournequette on your pride coaches and change it up! Win some games even if you have to admit what your “working on” isn’t working!
SCOrange, I stand corrected (and thoroughly impressed). I’m always glad to see another Brister fan on here! I was mostly being sarcastic, but I think you make an excellent point. Jay still has quite a bit of work to do. I don’t think I have seen him try to look off a defense one time this year. I think (and hope) that is one of those skills that comes with time. One thing I see Cutler doing a lot that reminds me of Elway circa early to mid 80s: He is relying almost solely on that “big” arm. Remember when Elway had receivers telling him he didn’t need to throw every single ball as hard as possible? It looks like he tries to use brute strength on every pass. The few times he has thrown touch passes, they have been very good throws. I know everyone out there is going to think I am bashing him, but I am not. I think part of the reason he is doing that is because he rarely has time to get properly set, because we do not have a classic pass-protection kind of line, so he feels the need to throw smoke in order to get rid of the ball. Once he smooths out those rough edges, I think he is going to be a much better qb.
LPP. I have an authentic Plummer home jersey that is brand new you can buy. You can have it for 10 bucks. Im serious. I just received my orange Cutler jersey today and I am pumped. Obviuosly you are a Plummer fan 1st and Bronco fan 2nd. Last note. Plummer didint show up at Tampa Bay camp because he wanted to retire. He knew that no way in hell he was beating out Garcia.
Many comments suggest, that our defense and special teams (except for Elam) are the major reason for the losses, while the offense is the only reason for hope. Too often, we face poor field position. This is certailnly due to a subpar return game as well as poor coverage on kicks. Another reason is often overlooked – our inability to sustain drives. There are too many punts after 3 and outs. This will ultimately leave the defense with a short field and make them gamble for the big play. Our offense needs a higher percentage of 5 yd. plays. The occasional big play does’t do it in the long run. I pin part of this problem on the O-line. Lepsis is not what he was before his injury. Both tackles need help, which hurts the run blocking. I am not sure, what we can expect from our O-line players on IR and practice squad next near, but I would like to see some help there next year. I also don’t understand, why the tight end is used so little, especially with so many RB’s banged up.
I might have an incomplete picture of this season. I am living in Germany and get only portions of the games. I am open to comments on my view of the situation.
Agreed Whitehoss,
Besides Tom Brady (who didn’t TAKE his team to the superbowl, Bledsoe did), how many rookies have enjoyed success in the playoffs. Did Shanny REALLY think Jay could have playoff success with our defense playing as lousy as it did the last half of the year? He threw in the towel on the season last year. The players are buying into the “maybe next year” mentality this year. Unfortunately, a lot of them are going to be wearing different uniforms next year. Hopefully Travis gets suspended so we can cut him with no penalties and we go after Julius Jones or Marion Barber. Foxworth will go for the big $$$ and be gone. Jared Allen and Terell Suggs are free agents but so is Ekuban….. There will be a few BIG changes next year, watch for it.
Everyone has all the answers, and talking as if these dudes are super heros. The truth is, adleast for this season what is to b will be.
I promise we will only get better.
I still cannot believe all this negative talk about Jay Cutler. HE IS STILL IN HIS FIRST FULL SEASON AS A STARTER. His QB rating is 85. That isn’t too bad. He is creative and smart. Do you Cutler haters actually watch the games on TV, or do you just read the stats. He has thrown for over 2500 yards already, and 13 TDS and 12 INTs I think. He has had a few multi interception games, but a lot of those needed to be forced. I see a guy who has used creativity to make plays when they haven’t been there. I can recall 4 or 5 great plays that he escaped the pocket and threw across his body for a huge gain. I am not at all worried about the offense. We have a lot of young guys. With time, the red zone offense will get better. It already has since the beginning of the year. We move the ball well when were not in a huge hole. Special teams and defense are our weak areas right now. Shanny did a good thing releasing Adams today. He is not in shape or dominant anymore. I agree with the poor defensive scheme. We do not attack the ball enough. We would be better in a 3-4 with our current roster, but we still need to develop our defensive line. We have a few rookies still, and hopefully they will improve.
Defense and special teams is where I would like us to focus. We have one of the best secondaries in the league with Bailey, Bly, Lynch, and Ferguson, but we still struggle stopping the pass. Don’t let the rankings fool you. We are currently ranked 9th in the league in passing yards allowed/game with around 228.6 yards. That sounds good, but it’s not. The only reason that number isn’t higher is because every team is able to run on us. Running controls the clock and tires the defense. We are 31st in the leauge in run defense, giving up almost 150 yards/game. That is horrible. No wonder teams run it a lot against us.
Our opponents are having a lot of success passing when they choose to. Look at Chicago and Oakland as the most recent success stories. They both are a run first teams. We did OK stopping them at first, but when they needed to pass, they did it with ease. Chicago had no choice to pass with less than 5 minutes in the game. Our defense made Rex Grossman look like John Elway (not quite). We did the same with Oakland’s QB.
So why do we struggle against the pass? Simple. Bottom line, we have one of the worst defensive lines in the league. We could clone 4 Champ Baileys and still not be able to stop a good passing attack because we don’t put pressure on QBs. YOU CANNOT GIVE THE WORST QB ALL DAY TO PASS. The difference between Peyton Manning and Eli Manning would greatly diminish if Eli had Peyton’s offensive line. IF YOU CANNOT GET PREASURE ON THE QB, YOU WILL HAVE A HARD TIME WINNING.
Why do you think the Colts destroy us every time we play a meaningful game with them? It is pretty simple. Our corners can only cover people for so long. Their O-line is so superior to our D-line that we have no chance of winning. The advantage always belongs the the WR the longer you give a QB to pass.
Look around the league right now. Who are the premier teams? Pittsburgh, Indianapolis, Dallas, New England, and the Giants. What do they have in common. They all have good to great defensive lines. They all pressure the QB. Their secondaries aren’t even comparable to ours, but they have more success because their D-lines take control. I’ll admit that New England’s line is OK, but their schemes make up for it. They have less talent on defense, but they always have more success than us. These teams understand the importance of pressuring the QB. It is the single most important phase of the game. If you have a poor O-line, you won’t win. If you have a poor D-line, you won’t win.
I’ll admit that we haven’t had a premier line in the last 10 years. However, we had success because we could at least stop the run almost as good as any team. That is just gone now. We can’t stop the run and we can’t pressure the QB. Until both or one of these areas significantly improve, we will continue being a mid-pack team. We have a good offense, that may develop into a great offense. We have good linebackers and great players in the secondary (even though I have to admit the Bly has struggled this year).
We have potential, but we are both too young and too out of shape on the D-line. However, Sam Adams was released the other day, so we are now just mostly too young.
Bottom line is this. If we do not significantly improve our rush defense by getting better play from our D-line, we will continue losing. We will never win consistently if our D-line is overpowered game in and game out. Improving our rush defense would make us playoff contenders.
However, if we don’t also get better at pressuring the QB, we will never be an elite team. We can do one or the other and win in this league. BUT, WE WILL NEVER BEAT INDY OR ANY OTHER TEAM WITH A POWERFUL OFFENSE UNTIL WE CAN STOP THE RUN AND PRESSURE THE QB. Even a great offense can’t make up for this huge gap.
Let’s talk about the real problems on our team.
Defense and special teams is where I would like us to focus. We have one of the best secondaries in the league with Bailey, Bly, Lynch, and Ferguson, but we still struggle stopping the pass. Don’t let the rankings fool you. We are currently ranked 9th in the league in passing yards allowed/game with around 228.6 yards. That sounds good, but it’s not. The only reason that number isn’t higher is because every team is able to run on us. Running controls the clock and tires the defense. We are 31st in the leauge in run defense, giving up almost 150 yards/game. That is horrible. No wonder teams run it a lot against us.
Our opponents are having a lot of success passing when they choose to. Look at Chicago and Oakland as the most recent success stories. They both are a run first teams. We did OK stopping them at first, but when they needed to pass, they did it with ease. Chicago had no choice to pass with less than 5 minutes in the game. Our defense made Rex Grossman look like John Elway (not quite). We did the same with Oakland’s QB.
So why do we struggle against the pass? Simple. Bottom line, we have one of the worst defensive lines in the league. We could clone 4 Champ Baileys and still not be able to stop a good passing attack because we don’t put pressure on QBs. YOU CANNOT GIVE THE WORST QB ALL DAY TO PASS. The difference between Peyton Manning and Eli Manning would greatly diminish if Eli had Peyton’s offensive line. IF YOU CANNOT GET PREASURE ON THE QB, YOU WILL HAVE A HARD TIME WINNING.
Why do you think the Colts destroy us every time we play a meaningful game with them? It is pretty simple. Our corners can only cover people for so long. Their O-line is so superior to our D-line that we have no chance of winning. The advantage always belongs the the WR the longer you give a QB to pass.
Look around the league right now. Who are the premier teams? Pittsburgh, Indianapolis, Dallas, New England, and the Giants. What do they have in common. They all have good to great defensive lines. They all pressure the QB. Their secondaries aren’t even comparable to ours, but they have more success because their D-lines take control. I’ll admit that New England’s line is OK, but their schemes make up for it. They have less talent on defense, but they always have more success than us. These teams understand the importance of pressuring the QB. It is the single most important phase of the game. If you have a poor O-line, you won’t win. If you have a poor D-line, you won’t win.
I’ll admit that we haven’t had a premier line in the last 10 years. However, we had success because we could at least stop the run almost as good as any team. That is just gone now. We can’t stop the run and we can’t pressure the QB. Until both or one of these areas significantly improve, we will continue being a mid-pack team. We have a good offense, that may develop into a great offense. We have good linebackers and great players in the secondary (even though I have to admit the Bly has struggled this year).
We have potential, but we are both too young and too out of shape on the D-line. However, Sam Adams was released the other day, so we are now just mostly too young.
Bottom line is this. If we do not significantly improve our rush defense by getting better play from our D-line, we will continue losing. We will never win consistently if our D-line is overpowered game in and game out. Improving our rush defense would make us playoff contenders.
However, if we don’t also get better at pressuring the QB, we will never be an elite team. We can do one or the other and win in this league. BUT, WE WILL NEVER BEAT INDY OR ANY OTHER TEAM WITH A POWERFUL OFFENSE UNTIL WE CAN STOP THE RUN AND PRESSURE THE QB. Even a great offense can’t make up for this huge gap.
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